That’s one of the lamest critiques I’ve ever read.
dclPost author
That’s because roads and parking are bits of government socialism that you like. As opposed to public transportation, which is socialism that you don’t like.
No, it’s a lame critique because a private enterprise has a multitude of options at its disposal to attract the workers it wants, and offering free parking is hardly socialist because by some calculation the net societal effect on the aggregate is that its employees will drive more (i.e. utilize more public resources). Suppose they make their employees pay for parking and more employees therefore take the metro. The metro is even more “socialistic”, so now the critique of Cato falls apart even further. Again, completely lame.
dclPost author
How is the metro more socialist than the massively subsidized road network?
gahrie
The roads are paid for by user fees (gas taxes etc). In fact governments routinely take funds out of these accounts to spend on other government services.
Public transportation is heavily subsidized by all taxpayers.
David K.
“Public transportation is heavily subsidized by all taxpayers.”
Define heavily?
And you don’t think that the drop in traffic benefits people who don’t make use of public transportation directly? Its really frustrating to see over and over again conservatives inability to see beyond the first layer interactions in systems. It’s like someone who has no kids complaining about paying for public schools. Just because YOUR child doesn’t go there doesn’t mean that you don’t benefit from such a setup. Lets try a little critical and deep thinking here shall we?
gahrie
I never said I thought public transportation should be eliminated. I really wish you would read what I write and respond to that instead of constantly misquoting me and creating strawmen.
Not only can’t public transportation pay for itself with the fares it charges, many levels of government actually subsidize fares in order to encourage people to use the public transportation they are rejecting.
Frankly I would like to see public transportation privatized to the extent possible, but not eliminated.
dclPost author
gahrie, that’s some impressive BS even by your standards. Do you have to work at being that uninformed, or does it just come naturally to you?
Not even sure where to begin. But roads are heavily subsidized by all taxpayers.
First, the user fees. The only place user fees exist is toll roads. The only roads that come close to being self supporting are toll roads.
Since you brought up gas tax, before it was cut because everyone was crapping a brick about gas tax hurting the economy, gas tax accounted for well below 50% of what FHWA spent on MATCHING funds for federal highways. That’s it. For those that can do math, what the federal government makes in gas tax accounts for less than 25% of what gets spent on freeways. Before the gas tax cut. For the gas tax to cover just the cost of freeways would require gas to cost at least 10 dollars a gallon in taxes alone. Probably more.
Many states have personal property tax on vehicles. This personal property tax accounts for less than 25% of what local governments spend on roads probably less, as politicians like to cut this tax to make people feel better. The roads, of course, are a public asset used by more than just cars and paid for by more than just cars.
In other words, roads are massively subsidized from the general fund at the federal, state, and local level.
dclPost author
gahrie, let privatize roads to the extent possible and see how much it costs you to drive anywhere.
gahrie
gahrie, let privatize roads to the extent possible and see how much it costs you to drive anywhere.
Will you drop all gasoline and other use taxes too?
If so, I’m all for it.
dclPost author
If you are willing to pay market rate for street parking too, then sure.
I’m not going to bother wading into the ridiculously bad logic and data being thrown about regarding roads, but I will say this: If you think public transportation comes anywhere close to roads and highways in the person / mile / dollar metrics, you’re probably doing the kind of drugs that made Ozzy Osbourne what he is today.
That’s one of the lamest critiques I’ve ever read.
That’s because roads and parking are bits of government socialism that you like. As opposed to public transportation, which is socialism that you don’t like.
No, it’s a lame critique because a private enterprise has a multitude of options at its disposal to attract the workers it wants, and offering free parking is hardly socialist because by some calculation the net societal effect on the aggregate is that its employees will drive more (i.e. utilize more public resources). Suppose they make their employees pay for parking and more employees therefore take the metro. The metro is even more “socialistic”, so now the critique of Cato falls apart even further. Again, completely lame.
How is the metro more socialist than the massively subsidized road network?
The roads are paid for by user fees (gas taxes etc). In fact governments routinely take funds out of these accounts to spend on other government services.
Public transportation is heavily subsidized by all taxpayers.
“Public transportation is heavily subsidized by all taxpayers.”
Define heavily?
And you don’t think that the drop in traffic benefits people who don’t make use of public transportation directly? Its really frustrating to see over and over again conservatives inability to see beyond the first layer interactions in systems. It’s like someone who has no kids complaining about paying for public schools. Just because YOUR child doesn’t go there doesn’t mean that you don’t benefit from such a setup. Lets try a little critical and deep thinking here shall we?
I never said I thought public transportation should be eliminated. I really wish you would read what I write and respond to that instead of constantly misquoting me and creating strawmen.
Not only can’t public transportation pay for itself with the fares it charges, many levels of government actually subsidize fares in order to encourage people to use the public transportation they are rejecting.
Frankly I would like to see public transportation privatized to the extent possible, but not eliminated.
gahrie, that’s some impressive BS even by your standards. Do you have to work at being that uninformed, or does it just come naturally to you?
Not even sure where to begin. But roads are heavily subsidized by all taxpayers.
First, the user fees. The only place user fees exist is toll roads. The only roads that come close to being self supporting are toll roads.
Since you brought up gas tax, before it was cut because everyone was crapping a brick about gas tax hurting the economy, gas tax accounted for well below 50% of what FHWA spent on MATCHING funds for federal highways. That’s it. For those that can do math, what the federal government makes in gas tax accounts for less than 25% of what gets spent on freeways. Before the gas tax cut. For the gas tax to cover just the cost of freeways would require gas to cost at least 10 dollars a gallon in taxes alone. Probably more.
Many states have personal property tax on vehicles. This personal property tax accounts for less than 25% of what local governments spend on roads probably less, as politicians like to cut this tax to make people feel better. The roads, of course, are a public asset used by more than just cars and paid for by more than just cars.
In other words, roads are massively subsidized from the general fund at the federal, state, and local level.
gahrie, let privatize roads to the extent possible and see how much it costs you to drive anywhere.
gahrie, let privatize roads to the extent possible and see how much it costs you to drive anywhere.
Will you drop all gasoline and other use taxes too?
If so, I’m all for it.
If you are willing to pay market rate for street parking too, then sure.
I never park on public streets.
I’m not going to bother wading into the ridiculously bad logic and data being thrown about regarding roads, but I will say this: If you think public transportation comes anywhere close to roads and highways in the person / mile / dollar metrics, you’re probably doing the kind of drugs that made Ozzy Osbourne what he is today.